My thinking is that there is huge growth around Plainland and more potential in Laidley and Gatton and battery/electric trains have the potential to provide good service there with very small infrastructure costs.
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The technology now available also allows for OHLE to be in discontiguous segments. I think it would be relatively simple to purchase bi-mode or battery trains capable of running west of Rosewood and also adding OHLE from Laidley to Helidon to minimise the amount of off-wire running needed. It shouldnāt be too hard to get rail services to Helidon - electrification itself isnāt that expensive an exercise and the line is in good nick and duplicated already. A proper coordinated bus service from Toowoomba to Helidon wouldnāt go astray.
Please letās not go down this downward spiralling path of hydrogen and battery trains to Toowoomba. It should be overhead catenary using existing NGR / QTMP stock. We also want trips comparable or faster than private vehicle trips. We are only looking at 80 km of electrification at most.
NSW has chosen Bi mode to replace XPT services that have trip lengths of 300km or more.
What is your solution to the Little Liverpool Range issue, or for that matter getting trains to Toowoomba in less than 4 hours?
There is a simple and credible way to get rail to Gatton / Helidon without having to actually do anything of substance other than string up some wires and leave a gap for the bit where that does not work.
(Donāt care what NSW is doing - it isnāt germane to the issue here.)
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This is incorrect. R sets will be used on the South Coast and Southern Highlands lines, both distances of less than 300 km.
One would (and should) modernise the heavy rail between Brisbane/Toowoomba, because it opens a world of opportunities and frankly, itās a state embarrassment they were not linked, long ago, by a quality inter-urban rail service. Such a link would play the key role, in opening vast affordable living options on the 'Downs and getting people away from the congested Coastal SEQLD corner!
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Hear hear!
There is also the long term issue of SEQ urban sprawl to the North and South starting to result in serious housing issues - weāre running out of land to build homes in a commutable distance (~100km/1 hour) from Brisbane.
The logical next step is expansion to the West, and 100km gets you all the way to Grantham. It is inevitable that an expansion of QRās heavy rail network further past Ipswich/Rosewood will be needed in the next few decades as more people move west in search of affordable housing (like in Sydney) - so why not get the ball rolling and establish a high speed, high capacity rail corridor at the very least out to Gatton already?
Another option Iāve thought of is Translinkās growing fleet of 200 state owned rail buses. Theyāre currently being leased to bus operators in SEQ for extra 50c fare capacity (presumably with some sort of contigency which states they need to be available for emergency rail bus services at short notice) - why canāt they be used for a high capacity bus network between Ipswich and Toowoomba? The trip is only an hour and if TMR were to set up a depot in Ipswich theyād still be close enough to the city to deploy as emergency rail buses when needed. The lack of seatbelts is a problem but I meanā¦ itās 200 brand new, state owned buses, why not put them to good use?
It is an embarrassment; youāll get no argument from me.
But the amount of time it takes to scope and procure rollingstock essentially means a minimum of 5 years before we see any operating trains on tracks. Momentum Trains consortium was awarded the contract for the new NSW regional fleet in 2019 and the first set has only just commenced testing on the first set on NSW tracks in 2025. And that says nothing about the track - especially from Helidon to Toowoomba.
Iād love to see a modern range rail ascent; but without Inland Rail, I donāt see it happening. I think the probable cost is one of the things that sent the feds running from committing to the project in Queensland.
Iād love to see us make use of the part of the track that is (mostly) in good working order. If I had a comfortable seat from Roma Street to Helidon that competed with highway speeds, Iād take it in a heartbeat. If we donāt get Inland Rail in Queensland, getting the planned alignment and tunnel between Grandchester and Laidley would be a good project to build in isolation if we were serious about regular passenger rail to Helidon (with bus transfer to Toowoomba).
But all of these things are 5+ years in the future. Iād like to see an interim regional bus solution in less time than that.
That, or QR can wheel out a couple units of the 2000 series Railmotors they still have to run a service if people are after that retro charm 
. DownsSteam has a rare Vulcan foundry-built BB18 1/4 (No 1037) and four SX carriages in mainline working condition (air conditioning and a toilet in one carriage has also been added!) if that suburban retro charm is more your style 
You are right though, the population out here is expanding, and from what I see, expanding rapidly. Wyreema is almost a suburb of Toowoomba now, as urbanisation continues southwards from Drayton and Harristown. Where I live in Warwick, many new lots in Rosenthal Heights are coming up for sale as multi-hectare farms are subdivided into ~800-1000m2 plots for people looking for space outside the city and where its feasible to do so.
Iād like to see proper service across the Darling Downs that meets the needs of the community. As Iāve suggested in other threads, we have a substantial population catchment that is essentially disconnected. There are good bits of rail and bad bits of rail. There are good roads and bad roads too. Itās on my āto-doā list to start a conversation about what a transport network for the region should look like, and all thoughts and perspectives will be most welcomed and appreciated.
ā¦But thatās a digression from the core of this thread about what should be done for Toowoomba - Brisbane.
Iād like to be aspirational, but Iād also like to see some tangible outcomes. I think we achieve both, but to me it seems likely that an interim and non-rail based solution will achieve outcomes in the fastest and most cost effective way, at least until we have clarity about what will happen with Inland Rail.
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Are the Ippy to Rosewood and beyond double track?
Inland Rail, will that be double track?
Tbh i think any passenger rail past Rosewood to Twba is down to new sections unlock by inland rail
Same goes for Beaudesert branch at Acacia Ridge past Salidbury
Yes. Regional buses can be on the road within a year or two. No corridor works, no electrification required. The road is already there.
So is the rail line. Battery/electric trains could go to Gatton tomorrow with essentially no new infrastructure.
Sure, we can be open to a side by side comparison on both cost, speed and time considerations.
Yes, but we also need to consider the broader benefits that things such as rail services bring in terms of supporting the development of more homes and businesses. Cities which are serious about this stuff donāt permit homes being developed without high quality tranport.
And these housing etc benefits are a result of the time savings that come from speed and frequency of the service.
These can be achieved by other modes, not just rail. Indeed, road construction into a new area simulates housing more given that most trips happen on that mode.
The housing and development benefit isnāt mode specific, unless weāre considering something like MSR or HSR where large time savings over the road option exist.
I believe the rail option would be the same or slower than the bus option all things considered.
The lower frequency of service - say hourly - is likely to mean any uplift will be very modest.
In any case, the bus option will need to be upgraded as the interim solution IMO.
I tend to think of it this way at face value.
If youāre travelling from Toowoomba - Ipswich or Brisbane, and you use Warrego, deviating in to Gatton comes with a moderate time penalty. If you deviate into Laidley, itās quite substantial. That would be suboptimal for travelers from Toowoomba, who represent the largest population base likely to use the service.
Conversely, if you live in Gatton or Laidley, having to transfer by bus to a stop on the Warrego comes with a significant transfer penalty, so a Warrego running service with no deviation is suboptimal for them.
The Warrego has lots of bits with a speed limit of 80 (and a lot at 100). The main railway line has lots of sections with speed limits of 80, and some with 60. Grandchester to Laidley is more like 30kph on average, owing to the 100-120m āsix chainsā radius curves in that section.
If you had a Toowoomba through service on the Warrego and required a transfer penalty for passengers to/from Gatton etc., for Toowoomba - Ipswich/Brisbane passengers, the bus would almost certainly be faster (traffic depending). The transfer penalty might make a rail option in the Lockyer Valley comparatively competitive.
If you had a Toowoomba deviating bus service, say, to Gatton (but not to Laidley), itād probably still be faster by bus than by rail. If you did the double deviation/ran Toowoomba - Gatton - Laidley - Plainland - Ipswich (for example), Iād be dubious that the bus has any time advantage anymore for passengers from Toowoomba versus rail to Helidon and bus transfer.
But I donāt think thatās what a service would look like. In my head (just a āgut feelā view), a possible bus service would look something like Toowoomba - Helidon (change to bus for Grantham possibly) - Gatton interchange or UQ Gatton (transfer for Gatton town) on Warrego Hwy - Plainland (transfer for Laidley) - Ipswich/Brisbane. You could consider more stops, like Toowoomba private health precinct (St Vincentās Hospital), Withcott, Marburg, etc. If youāre stopping adjacent to the Warrego, you need the road stops with appropriate infrastructure and ways for people to get across the highway safely.
For rail, you need to consider your rollingstock and how youāre going to power it. You need to be able to get a trainset out of the way of the 6 daily coal trains plus scheduled wheat/grain trains that use the Main Line. Itās dual track from Rosewood - Helidon (except Grandchester - Laidley), but trains are going in both directions all day. That may necessitate a bay platform with charging infrastructure if you go down the battery-electric (presumably multiple unit/BEMU) route, charge/dwell time depending. You need to consider your interchange to bus infrastructure. Helidon Station is effectively a large shed with a gravel road leading into it.
Itās not impossible, but there would be some supporting infrastructure works involved, not to mention the build and implementation of new trainsets. Thatās why I think it would take 5+ years to implement a rail based solution, even if a BEMU design and build contract were issued now.
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If we gotta electrificate the whole rosewood to twba incl new sections, the overhead wiring needs to have clearence from double decker hauls hence rollingstock needs extendable connectors to overheads if needed
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IIRC TransLink/TMR has already leased out some of the TMR fleet to TransLink operators.
TfB (BCC) has a fleet of 20 TMR owned Volgren bodied buses based out of Sherwood depot and are regularly on the 4xx series routes in the South Western suburbs. Kangaroo, Thompsons, etc on the Northside also use some of the TMR fleet on School and regular TransLink route runs.