Yes, somewhat diabolical. ARTC was required to dual gauge the line as a condition of a lease of the rail corridor.
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Almost sounds like a case of malicious compliance.
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That data is from 2-3 years ago, in which time a lot of the Gold Coast’s population growth came from Pimpama and Coomera, not the southern Gold Coast. And Logan-Beaudesert is second on the list, led by areas like Chambers Flat.
Whereabouts?
While there has been an initial up tick around Beaudesert it’s likely to flatline in the coming years.
What is this based on?
You’re ignoring that the largest beneficiary of this line won’t be Beaudesert or the Scenic Rim, it’ll be Logan. The line will be vital for access to the Flagstone PDA and developments in Greenbank and North Maclean.
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^^They need a decent bus service first
The 540 is already getting an upgrade from the Logan and Ipswich investment program. What more do you want to see?
I’d like to see the 535 increased to half hourly, and the last service leaving Browns Plains around 9:30 pm, not 8:30ish as at present
I personally know someone on this route who couldn’t get a retail job at Browns Plains, because they couldn’t get home after a 9:15 pm close (shop closes at 9, but they do other things afterwards). I wonder how many more are in a similar position?
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Merge these two plans, plus add extension to Brisbane Airports planned new terminal and there, we have the Mass Rapid Express. A new Automated train line.
This would be done in 4 stages. Stage 1a will be Salisbury to Browns Plains. Stage 1b will be Browns Plains to Flagstone. Stage 2a will be Salisbury to Hamilton via the City. Stage 2b will be the Hamilton to Airport segment.
Also the MREX will be incompatible with regular Queensland Rail Lines as firstly it will be standard guage not narrow gauge, and secondly it will use driverless automated trains.
Also these trains will be 3 car initially but can be lengthened down the track, but the main driver of capacity will be higher frequencies.
Edit: you can also just couple two three cars together to make 6 car.
I think if done right, it could be a roaring success and we could build more of these lines, but I’m getting a bit ambitious here.
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Having a suburban train to Hillcrest and Flagstone would be sensible. Having a high-capacity metro service to such locations is overkill.
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Neat idea of cross city corridors if done right plus extend existing doomben to airport & convert existing airtrain line to BRT network
Narrow guage can be driverless
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I don’t understand why’d you want MREX to Flagstone.
Over Sector One makes some sense but Flagstone isn’t beneficial whatsoever.
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Idea is that TOD will develop around the stations.
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Oh and this is just the first line too btw. A second line will run from Capalaba to Albany Creek via Carindale, City and NWTC and a third line from Chermside, via Doomben, Carindale, Mt Gravatt and through to Jindalee via Darra (that will be the loop line). And a fourth line will go from Ipswich to Springfield, connecting the Ripley developments and surrounding suburbs to the existing rail lines at Springfield and Ipswich. I think MREX is a good idea and also, it means we won’t need to worry about drivers. Eventually the Ferny Grove to Cleveland line can be completely sectored off, duplicated between Cleveland and Manly, have all level crossings removed and become automated into a fifth line.
Edit: Oh and should add, the CBD station would be connected to Albert Street station and located on the site of Uptown (former Myer Centre), which would be completely demolished and the Queen Street Bus station below would also have to go and Elizabeth Street may also need to be closed for years!. Reason for this is because it’s a prime location, and also because the current centre there sucks and the owners clearly have no plans on getting their act together about the place. Also given how few tenants there are, it shouldn’t be too hard to just terminate all the remaining leases still in the building.
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Prefer standard guage though. It’s a completely seperate system. We could even get away with privatising it but will need to find a way to make up the losses from the 50c fares, which will result in more gov subsidies.
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I’m not entirely enthused by the corridor chosen. It is still very early in the planning, so changes are also possible.
Here is the dilemma:
- The corridor from Greenbank to Salisbury seems to have been chosen because thats the easiest and the path of least resistance/least cost
- But that’s not where the people are. The people are centered around Mains Road and Beaudesert Road. The 130, 140, various other rockets and 150 bus services are among the most highly patronised in Brisbane.
- If this rail line is built on the western edge of Algester, then the impact on the 130 and like bus services might be minor. Over time the Queensland Government might also need to pay for a busway extension to say, Browns Plains.
This all raises a question:
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If a need for a future busway from Sunnybank through to Browns Plains is reasonably forseeable, does it make sense to build and pay for both a rail line and a busway, OR
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Could you just build one rail line following the alignment of Mains Road and Beaudesert Roads, snap up much higher patronage from better station locations (currently carried on BUZ 130, 140, 150 etc) and accessibility, possibly have TODs in this area, and avoid the future cost of a busway extension as well?
A rail line engineered to go under Mains and Beaudesert Roads would be more expensive, but it would also be a pay-more get-more value proposition. And given the volume of what buses are carrying in this area, it seems to make more sense to carry that transport task on trains.
The wiggly section between Coopers Plains and Runcorn could also be fixed up as part of this reimagined alignment. After serving Browns Plains, such a train would then rejoin the planned corridor at around Hillcrest.
Based on this, I would recommend the study be expanded to assess a heavy rail option via a Mains and Beaudesert road alignment, considering that a busway extension might be needed if the current Salisbury to Beaudesert corridor is kept.
The assessment should attempt to determine (a) the cost of a busway from Sunnybank to Browns Plains and (b) the timing and need of such a busway given the high PT demand in the area, as part of assessing this counterfactual scenario.
What do forum users think? Is the easiest to build alignment engineering-wise also the optimal alignment from a passenger-first and services perspective? Why or why not?
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Current Scenario
- Original Salisbury-Beaudesert plan is carried out
- Minor impact on passenger loads carried by buses 130, 140, 150, which continue to grow
- Bus volumes on Mains Road and Beaudesert Roads increases such that a surface transitway is required (these are not cheap anymore, given the experience with the Gympie Road part-time transit lanes, $172 million for just 2.3 km or $74.8 million/km)
- Brisbane Metro is put on the transitway, requiring more HESS buses and these buses to drive all the way to the Brisbane CBD
- Improvement in service speed, reliability and priority from the transitway cause patronage to jump, which in turn induces more buses to travel on it
- The transitway is replaced by a full Priority A busway, extended to Browns Plains. Given the history of busway construction, this is built in bits and pieces over say 2 decades, consisting of a mix of elevated, surface and part-tunnel sections.
Alternative Scenario
- Salisbury-Beaudesert rail corridor is altered to run along a Mains Road and Beaudesert Road alignment
- Section of wiggly rail between Coopers Plains and Runcorn is ironed out
- New stations potentially at Pinelands, Sunnybank Hills, Calamvale, Parkinson and Browns Plains (subject to change)
- Potential TODs developed around the above stations
- Due to rail option being chosen, the line is either built all at once or in incremental sections that extend from one end
- Bus network redesigned to feed rail, reducing pressure on the SEB
- Line-haul patronage on 130, 140 and other routes transferred from buses over to trains (say 3-4 million passengers/year move across from the bus)
- Freight rail, HSR etc still able to use the existing freight rail corridor.
Cost of avoided busway:
- 13 km x 150 million/km = ~ $1.95 billion ballpark (figure doesn’t include prior surface transitway costs)
- Busway would have to be 3.3 km longer than the rail option, as it would have to start at the SEB Klump Road interchange, whereas rail could start at around Altandi
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Salisbury to Flagstone doesn’t require a metro-standard service, and likely won’t for the next 50 years at least.
By comparison, the Mains Road corridor now is almost at the point where buses are approaching the limits of what they can viably carry, and we need to be thinking about what can be done about this.
In the coming post-CRR/LGCFR world (ie with more frequent services), I think more needs to be done to get Sunnybank residents onto trains. Resuming the Paloma Centre at Our Lady of Lourdes and turning Altandi into a major transit hub I think would be a good start, and maybe introducing or rerouting buses like the 135 to service either Sunnybank or Banoon Stations, rather than stay a block away from both. Not a silver bullet, but small changes that could help.
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This gets back to the points raised on the MREX idea. Just as Flagstone (and eventually Beaudesert) is an S-Bahn corridor, so Mains Rd is the outer end of an U-Bahn corridor.
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Better to be 50 years ahead then having to catch up and fall 50 years behind.
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Metro to Browns Plains. Not a bad idea!.
With the train option you could always start or end additional train services at Browns Plains. This would be similar to say how additional train services start at Cannon Hill or Coopers Plains to maintain a 15 minute frequency on the inner sections of the Cleveland and Beenleigh train lines.
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